Unbreakable Success Podcast, Episode 52
Dov Baron – How to Expand Your Thought Leadership Platform.
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There are few things in life as enjoyable as learning about someone's journey into successfully doing with that they absolutely love. Dov Baron is perhaps the epitome of one of those entrepreneurial journeys that I'm honored to share with you.
Dov is the host of the number one podcast for Fortune 500 leaders, has twice been named as one of Inc. Magazine's top 100 Leadership Speakers to hire, he's a multi-time bestselling author, and has been featured in the media in places like CNN, USA Today, The Boston Globe, CBS Small Business Pulse and so much more.
However, all of Dov's accolades aren't as important as his insights that he's giving you today on how to build a thought leadership platform. He's sharing how he got started building his platform, how write a book, and the power of finding what you consider to be your purpose and embracing it to be of service to others.
You know that we love every one of our amazing guests here on Unbreakable Success, yet I promise you that today's conversation with Dov is going to somehow feel special. He's truly an amazing human being whom I've quickly come to admire for his passion, authenticity, and genuine desire to support you in your business and personal life.
Please make sure you're subscribed to Unbreakable Success, and save this episode as one of your favorites.
TRANSCRIPT:
Aaron: 00:00 Everybody welcome back to another episode of unbreakable success. Dov Baron, thank you so much for, for sharing so much of your time with us today, sharing some nuggets, nuggets of wisdom for being here with us. Thank you. And how are you? How are things for you lately? It's been a little bit since we talked.
Dov Baron: 00:14 It has an. First of all, I want to thank you for having me on. It's an honor and a pleasure to come here to serve you and your audience. I've been as usual, crazy busy doing all kinds of wonderful things and, and people say to me, you know, you're so busy. Do you have time for anybody or anything new? And the answer is always yes. If you want something done, ask a busy person. But I just, I, you know, I'm doing what I love so I'm busy.
Aaron: 00:37 Yeah. So for, for those that don't know, obviously you've been in, you are one of the best when it comes to speaking. Uh, certainly. Certainly, I think if you probably don't know this right now, but I think he'd be like, it's one of those distance mentors that I look to and say, you know, that's some of the stuff you're doing is, is some of the things that I aspire to, so I appreciate you being here and if I can be selfish, I, I love having you here because I know I'm going to learn something from you as always do with my guests, but certainly to have the opportunity to learn from you is and share it with my audience as well as his extra special. For people that don't know you, you're enlisted in multiple places. One of the top 100 lead, a motivational speakers and leadership speakers in the world. You've been traveling globally for decades. Speaking to so many different audiences. You probably stopped counting many, many years ago. A written many books and all of that, but if we could, we'll. We'll get some nice nuggets where people can use in their business and in life obviously, but I'd like to give people some context about you. Like, where did this stuff, baron, a thought leadership plan, it's platform. Where did it start for you? If you could take us back in the day for a minute?
Dov Baron: 01:47 Um, well I've been speaking for 34 years, so it started way before there was such a thing as a platform. I went to be a book Expo America in 2000 and so, and I was there looking and finding out whether I needed a book deal or there or she'd get a book deal and I was talking to some people. Then one of the things they asked me is what's your platform? And I said, I have one platform since the seventies. I had no idea what they were talking about. Now I have a massive platform. You don't have people right now going, what is he talking about? Platform shoes if you're under 40, google it. So, you know, I, um, I didn't know what that was. And, and I realized from that that I need to go in and build a platform. And that meant in many ways.
Dov Baron: 02:41 I mean, I remember the first time is that, do you have an article? I'm like, what do you mean I don't write for a newspaper? They, he'd go, no, you need to write articles. I'm like, I don't even know. I mean, I've got well over $500 my own website now. So you know the thing with platform building, you know, it's interesting because you're asking about this and I want people to grasp this because I know where you're building your own platform as you're listening or watching right now and what I want you to think about is the, you know, people are going to come out with you with what is your platform and you need a platform. You need, you know, you know what you need. You need one article, one article, you need one show a video and when you've done that article, if they're not one video, then you go do another article and you do another video and you just, you know, instead of trying to become, it's easy for you to get shell shocked.
Dov Baron: 03:30 Go into overwhelm and go, oh my God, I'm never going to do it. But remember, I, you know, who have more than 500 videos on youtube, more than 500 episodes on my radio show, more than 500 articles on my podcast, on my, uh, on my blog plus thousands everywhere else. Sure. You know what started with one and you've got to remember that you start with one Gary Vaynerchuk, who we've all we all know started with one start with one. You don't start a thousand, so be patient with yourself and they think about being patient with yourself is then you get better instead of thinking, oh, I need to get too much first hundred, no, you need to do one that's good. And then do it. So that's good. And do it bit better than the last two. Yeah,
Aaron: 04:19 yeah. I love your sage advice, because I've certainly been there certainly been, there were people that I've, I've spoke to and clients who get the, you know, what is my, what do I need to build? And they think of building a huge thing. Obviously the platform, but you just have to do something. Get started with something. So how did that look for you when you were having this, you're, you're, you're them, about having this conversation, somebody kind of challenging you about this platform or are they described it back then? How did that evolution and kind of play out for you, uh, as time progressed and what felt right for you as you were doing it?
Dov Baron: 04:52 Part of the thing for me was I realized I'd been speaking for years and didn't really have any product and it didn't really have any consumable content as in articles and videos and audios. So what I did was I originally started with just, I didn't know how to do it. I didn't know what to we tried doing video is back in the day it was, it was too hot and it was too expensive and too slow or just work. But what we could do then was what was called teleseminars, which, uh, you know, tele conferences and then I would have four or 500 people at a time on those. But what I just started out with those was just recording somebody asking me some questions and I just said, I asked me five questions about this subject. You can ask me anything you want, I don't care, but just ask me five about the subject and I would just, you know, I would spend on that because I knew, I knew, I knew my material that I could do that.
Dov Baron: 05:52 And we, we took those recordings and we put them up as little audio samples, my website and that was hard to even load back in those days. A little bit of audio sample or somebody could listen to me answer a question about this for a minute, maybe three at the very most. And that was kind of the beginning. And then somebody said to me, um, again, you know, why haven't you gotten the articles yet? And honestly, I was so resistant variety for so many years because of her childhood trauma at school and all that kind of crap. And then he, and somebody said, well, have you tried transcribing those articles, those, those little interviews? I was like, no. So somebody did that and I looked over them and tweaked them a bit and then somebody did the grammatical side and then we started just giving that away. So that was where it started for me.
Dov Baron: 06:44 But if I were starting today, where would I start today? Oh, that's easy. I would start, I would make myself a discipline of giving myself a challenge. And that is 30 days, 30 videos, right? And people go, oh, I couldn't do 30 videos. Yeah you could. Because if I sat down to you and said, I want you to come up with 30 questions to which you know the answer to in your subject, could you do that? You Go, oh, I don't know. Maybe I could come up with five. And you go, okay, go do five. When you come up with five, I know you'll get 10 when you do 10, you did 20 million or 20. I know you can do 30. It's no problem. Just stop and you record and just record them. Either do challenge yourself to do one every day or if you're in the mood, you might do three that day.
Dov Baron: 07:25 Right? So know you can say, well okay, I can give myself a break for a couple days or I can just keep going, it's fine, but I would start with those simple little videos because they give somebody a chance to connect with you, they see you and it's not difficult. You just have to decide what it is you want to talk about. And by the way, one of the things you can talk about it and I want to help her out with this. You want to talk about something and you go, I don't know if I know enough that don't talk about it from knowing it, talk about it from not knowing about it. This is one of the things were thought leaders fall behind it. They aren't going to come out and I'm going to be the expert. I go, okay, that's great, but you know what?
Dov Baron: 08:03 I promise you. There's lots of experts out there. Yeah, but if you come at it on the other side, very few people do. You come at it on the side of I'm the advocate, not the expert. This is another position. So the expert is. I've been doing what I do for 34 years. I'm an expert. I've got books, I've done okay, but you've been doing this for 20 minutes, right? And you know people are gonna look at and go, you don't know anything, but if you come at it as an advocate, that's entirely different. So it come at, it was, oh, hi, I'm Bob. I am entering into the entrepreneurial world and I know that this thing is a landmine. It's filled with landmines. I don't know where to step, so I'm going to give a video each day and I'm going to ask a question to entrepreneurs who have been in business for more than five years and you get to watch that.
Dov Baron: 08:58 You get to see if you agree with my question. If you think I should tweak my question, we're going to ask entrepreneurs to answer. Oh my God. Now you're the advocate. Yeah. Yeah. Every one of us knows who Napoleon Hill is, right? We all read thinking, grow rich, but do you know that Napoleon Hill was not an expert? Just pulling the hill was a reporter to Andrew Carnegie sent out into meet the most successful people in said find out the common threads. So he just was an advocate for people who wanted to be better. So there's all kinds of ways to build that platform today without thinking about, oh my God, I gotta get a book out or I've got to do 300 videos, you know, none of that stuff. You don't need that. So easy now. Yeah.
Aaron: 09:39 And it's brilliant because uh, you know, one of the best pieces of advice I got and I'm still, it's still one of the things I work on to, to, to follow the advice was, you know, just start teaching everything you learn, like number one learning be a lifetime student, but as you learn things, teach them and, and, and like you said, there's going to be some things were, you know, a baron, if somebody is going to ask you to speak on leadership, boom, multiple decades of experience but all over the planet doing it. But if, as you said, if somebody is not in that position to have all that experience, they can just learn something and teach it or, or display it as you said, as you're learning it and as you're learning from the experts in and boom, there's a platform from that standpoint. I love the. I love the advice. I got a hit on something. It's good.
Dov Baron: 10:24 Go ahead and you something about what I was just saying just to help people get clear. Sure. Because it's something you just said. I think we best learn by what we teach. Sure. Yeah. But I wanna I wanna warn you if you're starting out, one of the biggest mistakes that I see people starting out trying to make. So you just learned a and now you're going to teach a to your audience. Great. If you try to teach a as an expert, you will look like an idiot. Yes. Don't teach you and is an expert. Give full credit to where you learned it. Yeah. So I was just on Dov Baron's platform or read this article about Bonnie weighed out these things. I want to share that with you because here's the three things you like, Yo put it on me that way, a, if it's shit, you don't get hard time for it to be.
Dov Baron: 11:14 It shows the audience that you have rapport with them. You have compassion for them, you have empathy for them and that you are not greedy, that you're willing to share, but not only that, that your mood, your ego to the side because you've leveraged the authority. Now, here's the thing, when you leverage the authors, you, somebody else, it elevates you and it's the. It's the mistake everybody makes. They go, oh, I don't want to look foolish, so I'm not going to mention that I learned it from Dov or I learned it from Aaron or I'm not going to mention that because I want to look good. It will actually make you look small, so flip the other way, so I just want to give you that because it was what you said was, was important and powerful, but that's the little piece on the end. Sure.
Aaron: 11:58 Beautiful. And I love the nuance. I love the nuance. It brings me full circle because you've mentioned something very quickly earlier about, uh, at the time years ago, obviously you didn't feel yourself as a writer and now you're, you're, you, you are an author of 13 books and I think it is, if I'm not mistaken, somewhere somewhere around a dozen or so mark, so you, you've obviously gotten over that. How did that, how can I process changed for you? Because that's obviously one of the big things, especially newer entrepreneurs are thinking, should I write the book? Shouldn't I, and how can I know that kind of stuff. Things that, as you know, for sure, once you get it done, you gradually becomes less scary. But how did that evolve for you as someone who wasn't really into I writing to now being a multi, multi time author?
Dov Baron: 12:43 Right. So for me, um, as you know, I had a mountain climbing fall in 1990 and I'm about two years later a friend of mine came to visit me from Australia and he said, he says, where's your book? What book? And he goes, your book. And they go, I don't want you talking about. I haven't got a book. He goes, that's the point, and I said, well, you know, I can't write a book, and he goes, why not? I go, because I'm terrible at spelling and I'm even worse at grammar. And he said to me, you know, something? He says, I've seen you speak like he'd seen me speak all over Australia and, and he says, he said, you're a fabulous baker. And I said, Oh, well thank you very much. He goes, and when it comes to writing, there are these people. He goes, they live in this special place, and I go, what the hell?
Dov Baron: 13:34 He's homer. He goes, no, they're not trolls. They're live under a bridge. They're called editors. You idiot. Oh yeah. I never thought about it. Honestly. It never crossed my mind that there could be an edit because. And it was my ego totally was my ego. If I send a piece of shit to an editor, they're going to go the guys a dumb ass and I couldn't live with that and my ego was way too big for that as opposed to saying, here's a guy who is not. It was not who was severely dyslexic as a kid who's got some great ideas but does not have put it together, let me become a d, and so I went looking for a developmental editor and I found two and what they did was awful. She was awful, so they were phenomenal. Change in my grammar and my spelling, which was my voice went away and my friend said to me, this is terrible because it doesn't sound like you.
Dov Baron: 14:29 And he said, if you were to say it again, how would you say it? And he goes, that is what you need to say. You just need your. Keep trying to write like a writer. Write like a speaker. Yeah. Just because people love hearing you speak. It goes. Then get the editor to correct the grammar and spelling and now and it was like boom. Oh my God. That became so easy because. Because somebody said to me, because I sit with is to you, what does this mean? And I say, what do you mean? What does it mean? It means what it says. And she goes, okay, you read it out loud. So I read it out loud to go, oh, okay. Yeah. Here's what it means because I've left the chunk out because I referenced it earlier in my presentation so it made sense in the position where you're in writing. So stop writing, like writing, let you think. Writers write, write like a speaker with your own voice and then get an editor to help you. That's how I started. That was the trend. That was. That was what made it so easy because I stopped trying to be a writer. You know, you should know there are writers out there who speak and they should have remained writers because it's like watching paint dry.
Dov Baron: 15:40 Seeing that for sure. Oh my gosh. Wow. You are a fabulous cure for insomnia. Thank you. Okay. Great information but terribly presented. Sure. But as a speaker it's not, it's, it's a much easier transition because you had the dynamics and the energy and the only way you can balls it up is if you give that away. Yeah. So you're, you're trying to do it correctly. So give up getting correct. Put it in your own voice, then handed it to him. And make sure that editor doesn't lose your voice and you'll be rocking.
Aaron: 16:11 Yeah, and it's so brilliant. It makes them. And it makes so much sense really if we all think about it because people love conversation is people have back and forth like this. People have stories and that's how most of us talk anyway. Certainly House someone like you or anyone who is who is who was a coach or something like that, where they engage in that kind of dialogue with people. It's natural, it feels natural, sounds natural, and it keeps you engaged. So to translate that into a, into a book, it makes that book engaging. And next thing you know your exact pages, you're flipping pages because you want to hear the rest of the story or you want to continue the conversation as opposed to you're kind of sick of being preached to or being, you know, given all this data,
Dov Baron: 16:51 this is the thing. You can't do that anymore. You know, there was a time, you know, I'm old enough to remember a time when the expert lectured at you and you took notes. Yeah. And if you do that today, even to people who went over 38, because that's the upper end of millennials, most of us who we were over that, we're all born with it too. We don't want to either. Yeah. And I'm seeing, I know because I've been in the business a long time. I'm seeing speakers who, uh, around my age who had dying. I mean these are guys who would the top of the world who like nobody shows up for because it's like watching paint dry. Sure. Because somebody's talking at them. People don't want that. Sure. It might. If you look on my website where it says speaking, it doesn't say keynote speeches says keynote conversations. Yeah. Yeah. Because I'm going to compensation with my audience.
Aaron: 17:36 Uh, I love. I know you had a campaign a couple of years ago. Was it? Killed it.
Dov Baron: 17:39 Yeah. I love it. 5 million people on that kill the keynote because like I, I know, I'm sure.
Aaron: 17:50 Sure. So I got a yes. The audience is the reality of the situation these days is, and I love to get your perspective on this is nobody's. People are impressed by information anymore because you can get information anywhere people are drawn in by, by context, by something that feels relevant to them and quite frankly, people want to have some form of entertainment. Everybody's fighting for attention, you know, professionally or personally, people, you know, if you're new and you hop on social media thinking, I'm going to suddenly become famous because I'm on facebook now that, I mean it's laughable because everybody's on there. So to just say I'm going to just put out information and assume people are going to be interested, I think it's a bit of a mistake. Would you agree?
Dov Baron: 18:34 I think it's, I think it's more than a mistake. I think it's, it's um, it's a trap, right? So because if you're competing because you have the best information, you will die very poor. Right. And so there was a time when that was true. We used to say content is king. Content is not king. It might be president, it might be pre, it might be, might be prince, might be princess, but it ain't, it's not king anymore because emperor is entertainment. Sure. Yeah. So the information has to be relevant, it has to be engaging, it has to be entertaining, and if it's not all of that, and then you are not going to keep your audience. And by the way, that matters more than facts. If you don't believe me, uh, there's a guy screaming fake news every day, you know, and it's not necessarily delivering facts, but you know, sure, about half the country thinks he's full of, you know, is the funniest guy in the world.
Dov Baron: 19:33 So if they understand that and as I want everybody to grasp this, particularly if you're starting out, I want to help you with those will, you need to know about human beings is we are tribal. We want to be belong. We want to be part of a tribe and be. And if we don't feel like a tribe, there is a pool for us to find a tribe to belong to. Your job as a leader, as a thought leader, is to create a tribe. You can't create a tribe by jumping on somebody else's tribe. That's number one. You can't draw. You can start a tribe by being wishy washy. That's number two is my good friend Larry winget said, and so you know Larry, Larry winget, it's one of the great leadership speakers, the pit bull of personal development and he and I were sitting in this place where I'm wanted Tequila.
Dov Baron: 20:21 We're sitting around and he says, yeah, he says, he says, if I don't get at least two death threats a week, I'm not doing my job. I love it. But it's that willingness to say something that matters to you not to be provocative. Sure. Because I don't give a shit about that. But to say something that, you know, I'm uh, my, when I work with Leah says, you know, I also train people to be speakers in, uh, authentic Speaker Academy for leadership. And one of the things I asked them, I say, what hill are you willing to die on? And most people don't know if you don't know what he'll, you're willing to die on. Nobody's going to follow, you know, cause it's like, well, you know, yeah, you, you're kind of. I mean, I watched this with the local election where I live. I'm on the weekends and I saw the debate between the full leaders for the marrow or position and one of the guys was very smart, but he flip flopped on a couple of issues in the last two months and they, the other three candidates just cut into pieces.
Dov Baron: 21:24 Sure, sure. The guy who won was kind of, it's kind of an ass and I watched him when my wife and I said, kind of assay, right? And she goes, yeah, no, I agreed with some of his policies, but he was kind of. I see with the other guys. And I went, Huh, it's interesting. And I said to my Missus, I think he's gonna win. And she said, why? So? Because that's the era we live in. It's not about liking answers, but it's about liking. People are not willing to flip flop because then I know, yes or no. Sure. You want to create a gathering or a career following. You were to create a tribe, find a hill you're willing to die on and then bury yourself in it. And what I mean by that is study everything about consuming, eat, sleep, breathe. It become that pain in the ass. We won't talk about anything else. So it embodies embroils you into every cell of your being. And then when somebody talks about it, you can go anywhere they want and they may not agree with you, but they will never think that you are under knowledgeable.
Aaron: 22:21 Sure, sure. A beautiful point. I love it. I love it. And it's so true and I find myself noticing in myself when I listen to other people and listen to podcast or read something and even if I'm reading or listening to someone who I just flat out don't agree with, I keep listening because I'm. Because I'm drawn in, I'm kind of curious. I want to know. I was just thinking, I want her to think I'm thinking, what am I missing? That I'm not thinking like this guy or this girl, but uh, and it doesn't mean that you're going to change your own opinion, but that it, it just draws people in that, that confidence that, uh, being willing to stick to a subject or stick to a prospective and own it and to say, this is me.
Dov Baron: 23:07 Absolutely. But you said something that I think everybody's got a loan from an and so I, um, I know the hill I'm willing to die on. Sure. But I have, if you're going to be a leader, thought leader or a leader in any form, there is one personality trait you must train and discipline and that is curiosity. You know, used to just set it right. You got to become deeply curious. So when Steve Bannon got thrown out of the White House, the first thing, as soon as I heard that news, I reached out to try and get him on my show really immediately. I didn't get him, but I wanted him on my show and people, well, why the hell would you want him? I don't think you agree with that. But. And I go, what the hell is that going to do with it? Yeah, sure. I'm incredibly curious. Guy Is obviously very smart and I'm very curious about where he's actually coming from and I'm curious about what he's big picture is. I'm still frustrated if I could get him on the show today, I would. Yeah. I think it's a fascinating human being and people said, well, would you have interviewed Hitler? Absolutely,
Dov Baron: 24:13 because I'm curious about human beings because that is my hill to die on is I'm fascinated with what drives human beings. I'm a master of discovering what drives them so they can see it and can use it to empower themselves as entrepreneurs, as speakers, as leaders or CEO's or athletes. It doesn't matter. That's my. That is my hill to die on. Now if you go, well, that's not my fascination. Then you shouldn't interview Steve Bannon. Your think your sales. I'm just using that as an example. Then you should go after people who sell in a way you hate, who's selling away you love like you've got to take in all of it, become deeply curious about it. I'm a speaker. I've been sober 34 years. I have purposely gone to seen, see people speak who I don't like. I purposely gone. I was invited to go see somebody. I was like, oh, I can't stand this guy. What an arrogant asshole gonna. Go see him because he. He has something because he's been on the stage for 15 years and he's doing very well. I want to know what that is like, so be curious about your, your industry, your subject, become fiercely curious about it, so it's consuming.
Aaron: 25:28 Yeah. That's brilliant. I love that you said and to everyone listening, I, I, I hope you're paying attention to what they're saying and and I hope you're connecting the dots, that there's a reason why he's been so successful for so long because he's billing to and willing to number one, to be curious and number two, to study and understand human behavior because if anybody's going to be successful in business today, you caught it. You've got to understand what your audience, what your clients, the industry that you're serving. You have to understand what they want and how you can get it to them and how you can communicate it to them, how they want to hear it, what's going to turn them on and what's going to turn them off. If you're not studying human behavior, and pardon my soapbox here, but if you're not doing your diligence to learn about what makes people tick and you think you're going to be successful in business, you're fighting a losing battle because you have to understand some basic tenants of what drives people and human psychology element. And you know, you're giving us a perfect example of why someone can be in business and thriving and growing for so long like you have because you've been willing to put in that work and, uh, in the trenches to, to learn it and live it. So I
Dov Baron: 26:36 thank you. I sincerely appreciate that. When you talked about the human behavior, you know, mine is, it's all consuming. It's what I do. But I would say to you as a, as a, as a thought leader, as an entrepreneur or whatever it might be, is it, that's a big subject. And can we be overwhelming? So find out the psychology of your people. Yes. Right? So if your people, um, uh, uh, entrepreneurs who make a 10 grand to 20 grand on the side hustle and find out the psychology of those people, find out what drives them. If your people are people who are scaling to their first billion, then find out the psychology of those people like so whatever it is like, so I know the psychology of humans, but if I decided, you know what, I'm going to go after people who really believe in orders, I want to know what their psychologies. I want to know what drives them because people will believe in or as don't do certain things and they only do certain things. And when you know that you can tap into that market beautifully because you actually understand them. Yeah.
Aaron: 27:43 That's a brand new once a week. You. Thank you. Thank you for feedback on that because that is, that is such a brilliant point to, to not only just understand human behavior, but yes, narrowed it down to what your focus is, what your niche is, what's your, what's your business is, and tighten it up in that aspect. I know we have, I love this, we're 30 minutes in and, and to be honest, I truly wanted, my intention was, you know, that's why I love doing this show because, you know, I kinda just, I come up with a little loose plan in my head of how I think an interview of conversation's going to go and I just, you know, let's just talk, but I really wanted to get into a, you touched on a little bit earlier, the story you had it, you had a pretty traumatic incident, something we have in common and at the same, same thing, but we both had an event that physically a jarring event. It was probably an understatement in your case for sure. Um, but I, I, I love to have the APP. You didn't have the opportunity if you don't mind to share your story, what, what happened to you and, and how that is, is condensed as you can, how that sort of shifted your perspective, uh, in life. I'll let you explain the story of how that went down.
Dov Baron: 28:55 Thank you for asking. I sincerely appreciate it. Um, in 1990, I'd already been speaking for six years. Um, I was probably the most successful I'd been up until that point. A was on TV, radio, newspapers, traveling all over, speaking all over. It was all going pretty great. And I was pretty fried and exhausted. I came back to Vancouver, which was my new home for the last couple of years by then. And um, my manager had scheduled me for days off and I was scheduled months in advance, so been grabbed. I went up to a place called Whistler, which some of you may know, which is where the Winter Olympics were held in 2010. And we went up that a buddy of mine and I, but it was June. It was beautiful sunshine and um, you know, sort of hung out and that it really relaxing. So Simon in, I decided that we'd go for a hike to a place called brandywine falls, which is this magnificent waterfall water comes off the glacier and runs down and it falls 200 feet off a cliff into the bottom.
Dov Baron: 29:59 And it's magnificent to look out from the top. But I wanted to see what it was like from the bottom because my main line drug of the day for many years before it was adrenaline is a full blown adrenaline junkie. So we hiked down and I challenge my buddy that we should try and get behind the waterfall. So you're a 70 mile an hour spray coming at you and you know, and we're walking across moss covered rocks. It was incredibly difficult. But we got behind that and the gap is like, you know, it's like four feet and put your arm out would take your arm off because it's tons and tons of water. And we stood behind that. I came out in the other side and I honestly, I felt like Superman. I felt indestructible and so I said to my buddy, let's not hike back up.
Dov Baron: 30:39 And he's like, well, what else were you going do? And I go, let's climb the face. And he's like, well, you tell him about now if you know anything about mountain climbing, you know that you have ropes and you have safety lies and hooks and all kinds of things. And if you free climb, you don't have those, but you have dry clothing, you have the right footwear, and you have chalk. We had none of those. So you know, so this was free climbing for the moderately insane. No, actually fully insane struggle with drinking and at about, you know, without the details that are about 120 feet, which is about 12 stories up. I reached her rock that dislodges the bigger up, Bam, hit me in the face and 70 hurdling down at maximum velocity where I landed on my face on boulder's not on gravel and grasping on boulders and it completely destroyed my face.
Dov Baron: 31:27 I'm telling you the gory details, there's no need. Sure. Um, what will tell you is that I have had somewhere between 10 and 12 reconstructive surgeries. The pain and recovery was insane. I've been a bodybuilder since I was 19 years old. Um, and the day I fell, three weeks later I was 50 pounds lighter, might just completely emaciated jaw wired to hold it in place and closed and drinking through a straw and one and whatnot down there. And all kinds of weird stuff. But when people would ask me how you're doing, um, I would lie. See, I was born in the ghetto. I was born in a tough environment where, you know, you learn to put it on no matter what. And I had been in leadership, I don't, companies in three continents. So I'd been in leadership, I, you know, I'd been a boxer, was a martial artist, so, you know, I knew how to be tough.
Dov Baron: 32:27 And uh, so when people would say to me how you're doing, I'd say I'm Greek, meaning I'm great. My teeth were wired closed and I didn't want anybody to know that I was actually in a very dark depression. And then about nine months in when I hadn't, I don't even think I'd smiled in nine months. And I really started to believe that maybe I was never going to be happy again. And My, my boys, my mate said, you know, let's go for a night out. And I went for and I am, like, wires were off. And they went for night out with the lads. And I had a great night and I laughed. And I was like, Oh, you know, maybe I can't. Maybe I am coming back because I used to keep saying when people ask me and say I'm great, I'm coming back. I'm great. I'm coming. I thought maybe I am. When I walked in the door and as I opened the door in this dark, the light shine in to the kitchen, I could see across the floor, garbage festoon there was empty. Ken's coffee grinds, kitty litter, the whole, Oh, it was a big mess. And it smelled bad. And I knew exactly who the culprit was. And I went from feeling
Dov Baron: 33:28 elated to enraged and I went and looked for the culprit. And when I got into the living room that was the culprit curled up on my couch, looking so comfortable and I lifted my hand in rage. And I will tell you what, in all seriousness, I was about to strike. I stopped. Yeah, something can be stopped because that's not who I am. And I picked up the cat and I realized the cat was cold and it was dead. Oh Gosh. And I fell to my knees and I began to weep. And cry and you know, when you have the sobbing, and I was suddenly realized, why am I solving for a cat that I didn't even like and I didn't like the cat. The cat was given to me as a gift via manipulative girlfriend. So I didn't know what was going on.
Dov Baron: 34:17 No. Suddenly I realized that I was crying for the loss of the life that I had, that that dog was dead. There was no coming back. I noticed on the floor in the fetal position. And I knew before me there was three paths to try and come back, which I failed miserably at. That was never gonna happen. The second path was the most seductive path which was to stay here in this place of feeling like a victim and that I was justified and I was, you know, uh, you know, shit happened and it was not my fault and there was a third path and it was the move forward with purpose. And that was all I knew and didn't know what that meant, but it was terrifying, terrifying because I couldn't use any excuses and I couldn't talk about going back and have to move forward.
Dov Baron: 35:05 And I began to examine what my purpose was. Now prior to that, um, I, I was doing a lot of work on myself and continue to do, had done for many, many years and felt like I was never going to come into the speaking world again. And it was, I did the work to find my purpose. And, and the, the problem with finding your purpose is you don't know. I mean, you do everything you can to be aligned with your purpose, but you don't actually know if you're doing it right because it's not like a box gets checked. No. Did I save $100? Check? Yes. No. Different than that. And then, uh, about two years later I was teaching a multiday training. And at the end of the training, people were very generous as they usually are. And they sit at the end and thanked me one by one lined up.
Dov Baron: 35:57 But I have had a plexiglass shield that many of us know speakers, meaning that nothing actually gets in and I don't want, I actually want to let people in because they're being generous with me. And so how do I lower this shield? I become cognitive. And so I say to them, so they would say thank you. And I'd say, can I ask you specifically for what? Which makes me stop and makes them stop and makes it so this lady was wonderful. She was probably at the latest early forties, nice looking lady. And I said, uh, she said, thank you. And I said, can I ask you specifically for what? And she was wonderful. She took a pause and she said, oh, for my grandchildren. And I said, you don't look old enough to have grandchildren. And she said, I'm not. And they said, I don't understand.
Dov Baron: 36:44 She goes, see that lady over there? I said, yeah. She said, the pregnant girl. She goes, yeah. She says, my daughter, she goes into the three days we've been here and we've learned about our own purpose and what matters to us. She goes, you've changed our relationship, you've changed my relationship with my son in law who was with her and her and it will change my relationship with my grandchild. My grandchild arrives in the in the world and at that point where like my eyes started to leak and I realized that when you're on purpose, you are doing something that is a rippled legacy. I'm here to impact people's lives, who may never know my name and whose name I may never know, that grandchild would probably never know my name and maybe it will be changed and that grandchild child will certainly know who I am. It doesn't matter because I'm on purpose. I'm having positive impact in the world and that transformed everything for me. That was at the time, the worst thing that could have happened for me and afterwards when I did the work, because that's what it calls you to do. It was the greatest thing that ever happened to me, but if somebody said that to me on the day of fallen, I would have punched him in the nose. It could, but later on, certainly with retrospect. Definitely. Yeah. Wow.
Aaron: 38:04 Well, thank you for sharing that. I mean there's so many. Everyone listening, I'm sure there's, there's so much to take in from that and certainly some powerful lessons to learn and ponder and I, I, I have the same board at first and foremost. Thank you for, for taking that situation and, and making that decision. You mentioned you have three choices to make A. I'm grateful for sure, uh, that you made that third choice and in our continuing today, so many years later to do the work that you're doing in a band have having impacted God at this point. Countless, you know, people that are alive and, and grandchildren and great grandchildren to come. I'm sure we can get exponential with this conversation, uh, for certain. So, uh, thank you so much. I, I can't think of a better way to, to, to peak this a wonderful conversation I've enjoyed so much than, than to, than right there.
Aaron: 39:00 Uh, so the, the, of course, the most important question I can ask, not for myself, but for everyone who's listening is for people that are listening right now and I'm sure they want to learn more about your world and what you do. Please let us know how to find you quickly so people can continue their conversation with you. By the way, make sure you let them know about your podcast because it is a powerful podcast. I'm for everyone's listening. I'm going to let them tell you what this podcast is with an order of. Go subscribe right now. Uh, it is, it's a life changing conversation with some really wonderful people, including the of but many amazing guests that he has. So with that, please let us know.
Dov Baron: 39:39 Thank you, Aaron. That's very kind of. You can find out more about all of those things@fullmontyleadership.com and click on podcasts and you'll get access to the podcast. As Erin said, it is the leadership and loyalty podcast is not just about leadership and loyalty. Leadership and loyalty can podcast as the number one podcast in the world for fortune 500 listeners, a inc com made it the number one podcast I listened to to make you a better leader. We've had all kinds of beautiful accolades in. We also go out through traditional radio stations across the United States. And, um, I have my own Roku channel and the soda, somewhere around about 800,000 streams a month. So it's a pretty popular show. And I encourage you, as Erin said, please, I'd love you to go listen reviews and subscribe to it. You can find my blog also in months, monthly leadership dog comments under icons. And as I said, there's over 500 articles on there you can find out, can find me on youtube, Dov Baron, full monty leadership on a Linkedin, @DovBaron Dov b, a r o n twitter @theDovBaron, uh, instagram, @DovBaronleadership. So all the usual places, Google me, you'll find me all over the place. Uh, I write for entrepreneur and a bunch of other magazines. But here's the thing, if you
Dov Baron: 40:58 are honestly, as Aaron said, I've got a podcast for a long time, 10 years, and I said this at the end of my show, inflammation is worth the whole donut. It's transformation only comes from application. So here's the thing I want you to do, and this is important,
Aaron: 41:14 okay,
Dov Baron: 41:15 parents here, putting out these shows, finds you great guests, brings those guests on the show to supply you, to give you the insight and the knowledge and the value that you get. You don't pay for that, that's free, but it's not free for Aaron. It cost him his time, his energy, his effort, his commitment, all your things, production. There's, there's all kinds of costs you can't even consider. What I want you to do is I want you to go to itunes. I want you to go to his youtube channel and subscribe to his channel and I want you to thank him for bringing the guests on. And what's more. I'm going to give you this because I don't see how you can get in touch with me. I'm going to. I'm crazy. I'm going to give you my personal email, my personal email is dov@dovbaron.com.
Dov Baron: 42:00 Write to me, cc Aaron and tell us what you got out of this. Show, what you're going to do with it because it's great they brought your fabulous information, but you got to use it. So write to us, tell us what you're going to do with it and if I can be of service to you, that also gives you a way to get access to me that your jump aligned. We'll probably push you out for about six months to get to connect, but you can jump that line if I can be of service to you in some way that you would like to work with me, we can talk about that too, but let Aaron know, rate, review and subscribe to his show and I'd love you to do this. I'm a mind. Thank you.
Aaron: 42:36 Thank you so much. So I can't. I can't tell you how much I appreciate that. Thank you so much. Thank you again for being here and thank you everyone. Of course for listening. I'll make sure I link up all those, uh, all those connections depending on your preference of how you want to get ahold of Dov. I'm like of all up in the show notes at Aaron Keith Hawkins Dot Com. As usual. Uh, if you go to Aaron Keith Hawkins Dot Com, just type Gov and the search bar Dov, if you don't feel like looking for the length this, use the search bar type, Dov Dov that will bring you to this episode and you can get all the links to Dov is his book, his works, his podcast a even. I'll just make sure I link some of his many articles in there as well. So you can really get beyond what you heard today.
Aaron: 43:15 Going to go get a better idea of what he's about. Dov, I love having you on you. You instantly struck me as one of those leadership experts who weren't just a leadership expert. You kind of joke, but you're serious about how your show is not just about leadership and loyalty. It's about so many other things. Uh, I love the fact that you're a thinker and you're always thinking about the humanity behind everything we do, and I have no doubt that's why so many leaders around the world are so enthralled with you do because it is, it, it, it's, it's a culture change. I know in many organizations that you work. And so, uh, I recognize that and appreciate it and appreciate you and your work and wish you a massively continued success. Everybody listening, make sure you reach out the Dov and thank him, as he mentioned earlier. Personally, we will definitely stay in touch. I appreciate your time and I'll speak with you soon, my friend. Thank you so much. Thank you.